Mongolia - Story with Tugso Bridging East and West

In this episode of Where Next? Travel with Kristen and Carol, we return to Mongolia—this time through the eyes of Tugso, a Mongolian native now living in the U.S. She shares a deeply personal and vibrant portrait of her home country, from nomadic life in the northern mountains to the unique blend of traditional and modern living in Ulaanbaatar. We talk about everything from shamanism and Soviet influence to the fierce independence of Mongolian women, the simplicity of daily life, and the warmth of a culture where community and hospitality still reign.

Tugso also gives us a peek into Mongolia’s biggest holidays, including Naadam with its wrestling, horse racing, and archery, and how New Year’s is celebrated with sparkle, family, and salty milk tea. She reflects on how her upbringing shaped her values around minimalism, resilience, and pride in heritage. Whether you're curious about taking the Trans-Siberian train to Ulaanbaatar or just want to understand why Mongolia is unlike anywhere else, this episode will expand your perspective and leave you longing for a visit.

Map of Mongolia

Chapters

• 0:15 Exploring Mongolia With Local Insights
• 16:22 Life in Mongolia
• 28:04 Cultural Shifts in Mongolia
• 40:16 Traditional Holidays in Mongolia

Transcript

SPEAKER_00: 0:00

Hi, welcome to our podcast, Where Next? Travel with Kristen and Carol. I am Kristen. And I am Carol. And we're two long-term friends with a passion for travel and adventure. Each episode, we interview people around the globe to help us decide where to go next. In this episode, we once again visit Mongolia. In episode 63, we had interviewed an American who fell in love with the country and moved there. And this time we were speaking to a local that grew up in Mongolia and has moved to the U.S. Tungso is so passionate about her love for her country and shares what makes it so special. We talk about the holidays, the history, and we discuss how the culture is very different than here in the U.S., especially around material items. Enjoy. Dukso, thank you so much for joining our next podcast today. And thanks in advance for teaching us about Mongolia. We're so excited. Of course, yeah. I'm happy to. Thank you for having me. Sure. I'd love to start and say, when did you come here to the U.S.? You grew up in Mongolia. What did that look like? All your history. Well, yeah, I was born and raised in Mongolia. I met my husband in Mongolia. He was a peace governor. I had a lot of foreign friends over there, but When I decided to, well, I came here to visit first and to see the, you know, like after he finished a two year period of Peace Corps time and he came back and I visited, you know, who wouldn't like California in November, October.

SPEAKER_01: 1:53

especially Bay Area.

UNKNOWN: 1:54

Oh, it's beautiful. He took me to Yosemite. I love this. Oh, I loved it. And then, like, I went back again, still not sure, you know, and then I went back again following the year in March, and then I welcomed my college friends who are here. It's, you know, like, diverse and different languages and food, you know, like, I loved it.

SPEAKER_00: 2:13

And then, and then after living with my husband six months, we were like, you know what, here we are talking about, like, the document, a foreigner, I can't, just being your girlfriend forever. You know, I have to eat the in and out of the relationship, you know? And then we decided to get married. And then that's the... Luckily, my husband, as he lived in Mongolia, he knows my people, he knows my culture, and he's from Bay Area. That really helped me to move in there. It's a lot of challenge, but again, I went to sick after several years later, and I recovered, and I get treatment. Amazing. I cannot say anything. negative things about America especially the science you know I'm into science and it's like been through a lot but again it's it's a great country you know that even though there are a lot of things that still astonishing me you know like I didn't know like woman paid less than men until very recently I was like what and just be just being a woman you can get paid list. I couldn't understand that. It's still, I'm having some troubles, but, you know, there are a lot of things. It's very interesting. It's still challenging to understand. It's difficult to adjust it, yeah. And I'm so interested in, I remember when we talked, you said that, and it kind of shocked me because, and it's kind of weird that That would be a normal thing for us to just understand. Like, yep, that's just the way it is. Well, why is that? Because we're still doing the same thing. But in Mongolia, how is that between women and men and women working? Well, the women, because we have a lot of influence from Soviet Union, you know, they were doing communist time, women's work. Women are really strong. Most of the, like, you know, teachers and doctors, all the women are really educated. Again, like any other country, it's like decision-making positions are mostly men. Even though women's right is much higher, women are more respected than any other countries. I didn't know that. Like, because even their name, if... We don't have he, she linguistically. We have that person. And through email or writing exchange, the person would know I'm a woman. Until if we see each other, we don't have the gender linguistically. Maybe that's one of the factors that can affect a woman's language. role, I think. And then again, families, they invest so much for girls' integration than men. We believe, oh, men can get by doing some labor work. They can be okay. But the women, we need integration. So if there's a family have choices between women and men, girl and boy, we invest more girls for integration side. Yeah. Yeah. And it just kind of like the whole, like, not really having the he, she pronouns. Is there any, like, trans people that are, or like non-binary, as we call them here? No, not really. Again, you know, I left the country almost 20 years ago. If you guys going back home, you know, after living abroad, you still have Walmart. You still have your Safeway, you know?

UNKNOWN: 5:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 5:58

But when I go back, there are a lot of changes. Especially the last 10 years, it's a lot of change happened. But there is now the like gay rights are, you know, they're getting a lot of noise. But growing up, it's unfortunately in any other countries in being gay and trans people, it's very compressed. Yeah. Okay. And were you living, because we did another episode once for someone toured people for like nomadic living. Did you live in a city when you were there or did you move around? Yeah. I was born in countryside, but I raised in the city. But if you go to countryside now, the people are still living as... Hundreds of years ago, exactly the same. The families wrap up the yurt, like Westerners call it yurt, we call it gear, wrap up, follow up the animal. They need the pastures, organic pastures, three times to move around the year. So it's still the same. And the kids go to school in, like I make, we call it like province center, like dormitory. And the family still, you know, the quarter still move around three times a year. My grandparents lived in the mountains. I'm from northern side of Mongolia, close to Russia. So they were in the high mountains. My grandparents lived in a tipi, kind of like Native Indians live in a tipi. Sounds so cold. When I went to, first time I went to Yosemite, they said Native Indians and tipi. I was like, oh my God, that's my grandparents exactly lived in the same shape after, you know, living situation is very similar. And then also they even did, very spiritual. The shamans are still the same. It's very interesting how similar the Native Indians and Mongolians are, especially the facial features are very similar. I cannot distinguish between Native Indians, Tibetan, and Mongolian. I'm really good at distinguishing. Oh, Chinese-Japanese is easy, but for some reason, Tibetan and Native Indians, Mongolian, it's very, very similar. I was watching this show called Apocalypse Ancient Something Civilizations, and they talked about how people actually from Mongolia came over across into Alaska. It used to all be connected, and then they came down. Oh my gosh, it's such an interesting show. Wow. So do you speak any Russian since you were kind of close to Russia? Well, we learned in high, in middle and high schools. We have a lot of, that's why I have more Russian accent than a lot of people think I'm from Eastern Europe because my second language is Russian. I really need to refresh my Russian language. If I go back to Russia, I think, you know, I will be okay, but I miss Russian language. I need to, I need to refresh it. Yeah. So, and what's the native language in Mongolia? It's Ling it's completely different than Chinese and Japanese and Korea. I think it's a similar thing Family is a Turkish language. We have similar words there. But it's completely different languages. It's very different. And does the whole country speak the same language? Yeah, the whole country speaks the same language. Only one language, Mongolian. It's like the population has grown up. It's a big sandwich country, if you guys know that. It's landlocked between Russia and China. In 1921, Russians came to Mongolia, like, great Bolsheviks. They came to Mongolia, helped us to kick Chinese out. And Chinese has dominated Mongolia hundreds of years. Even though Mongolia, we were able to keep the language and keep the culture. But even though there's still some, like, culture influence there. But, you know, like, with the language, like, Mongolian, it's like we always, we keep the language and it's very amazing how tiny bit, like population wise, we're so tiny growing up, growing up like Mongolian population at 2.3 million people. And now maybe close to 3 million, but still it's very, you know, comparing with the country size, population is very, very small. Oh yeah. And that's like less than all of Colorado. Wow. Yeah. That's much bigger. I was also curious, like, um, It's cold there, right? Well, yeah, the summer is very short. And then it's very, very cold. And, you know, like, especially people in the countryside living in New York, they're like very efficient way, everything. But it's very, very cold. Even though it's warmer than Chicago cold. I went to Chicago a couple of times. Evanston, my friend lives there, Evanston. And right next to the Michigan Lake. The wind goes to your bone. But it's in the Mongolian. We have the right gear, like warm shoes. Yeah. That helps. Even though women in the city, we still wear high heels, still have proper makeup, high heels. Nice. I... I don't know. Like, I used to wear high heels in the snow and the ice. I don't know how we were able to. I was just talking about it with my sister. Like, I don't know how we did it. But, you know, because our experience is, like, really important. Like, if I go back to Mongolia now without my nails done proper, like, decent look, people, like, will, like... You know, are you okay? California hippie. Yeah. People will ask, are you okay? I cannot wear my, you know, yoga pants, Lululemon yoga pants. Can I go to grocery store? You have to put together. I think it's still there. I think it's a lot. It's a woman I really will put together. Even in the winter, we had the mink coat, like, you know. Now, Is that when you're in the countryside, too, or just in the city? It's mostly in the city, even though countryside and the center still especially teach women really well. But that's how you respect yourself. That's how we tell, you know, if you respect yourself, you, you know, you sleep together, you know. Yeah, that is interesting. Anyway, yeah. So I just, I admire Mongolian women now. I understand more, like, anyway, yeah.

UNKNOWN: 13:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 13:07

Well, and I'm also curious, first off, I was like, oh my gosh, how did your grandparents in their yurt stay warm, their teepee stay warm and fire? Like, what did that look like living in that growing up or when you were there? My grandparents, unfortunately, I didn't know them. They passed away before... I know before, I think they're past women, I was three years old. Well, like any, they have a, like they grab the wood and they make a firewood, but it's again, the place is small and then they need, they had what they need. They don't have extra. Still grown up during communist time, you know, the happiest childhood. My parents have like employment, very secure, they're free, free healthcare. And then, but we didn't own anything, you know, like my father bought a When I was in high school, I didn't like it. He wanted me to take to school. I didn't like it because I didn't want to look like capitalist, you know, like... We didn't need it. Yeah. We need, my thing about it, we had everything there, but we didn't have extra, but we didn't need the extra. That's why the first time I went to Safeway, I was really overwhelmed. I wanted to buy a green tea. Entire shelf was tea selection. Still, I can go to Safeway. I go to, I like farmer's market. I like Whole Foods. If there's anything I can handle, I traded yours. If there's anything safe, my husband goes there. It's just too much. Costco, don't even think about it. Costco's good. There's not so many choices. It's a little bit easier. That's true. It's too much. But it's too many quantities. Overwhelming for me. Yeah. I like the small supermarket. We call it supermarket, but it's not super. But I like good and small things. You know, like especially groceries that, you know. Yeah. Anyway, yeah. So when I, oh, babysat us, used to be babysat. I remember when I get pregnant and we're like buying all of these things. I tell my husband, we don't need this. Why do you need the changing the pad? Like it just changed. No, we need to have everything. That's a whole different conflict. Oh, yeah. We need to buy a binky, you know. Yeah.

UNKNOWN: 15:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 15:32

Pacifier? Entire shelf was binky. Again, all the hormones. I'm pregnant. Like, I just, I need to live. It's too much. I can imagine. Like, no wonder I have one child. I couldn't do anything twice. When I was curious, how is it living at, like, when you grew up in Mongolia, were the schools similar? What kind of, like, did you have breakfast, lunch, dinner kind of similar with there? What are the foods and just like? Again, simple, like a breakfast lunch. More like growing up, more like, We don't snack. The thing I learned recently, we don't snack. Yeah. We have, yeah, breakfast, lunch and dinner. Dinner always like a family gathered. And then because of we have everything small there. We growing up in apartment, we didn't have like big house and price, especially in the city. Like if you watch the Soviet Union, all still now in Russia, like multiple layer, like floors of big apartments. That's how. And then, you know, each family have a refrigerator small. Every time in the evening, my mom will get the fresh groceries, make a dinner and then dinner and eat. And the next day, if there's leftover groceries, we can cook and then we'll buy it on the way. It's like we buy small things, not that big amount. Oh, right. And then, but the schools, we don't have like schools. We have the cafeteria, but we need to buy it. There's no, like here, like every school has a cafeteria, eat our food, you know. I don't remember, we didn't have it. The school is, we don't have kindergarten, we have a preschool, but first grade till 10th, we have only one school. So 10 years, you are the same people. That's why we are really community-wise very close-knit. Like if my mom now passed away, my high school, not my middle school, my school friends will come to visit me to sit with me to grieve like that's the thing I miss it a lot you know like good time bad times the community wise it's very very strong my mom come to visit here she will look for her present here high school friends daughters newborn like it's very very welcome and I was like How does it like, in a way, it's like, yeah, I miss the class community sometimes. I agree. I really love that sense of community is so powerful and uplifting and just kind of sharing. I mean, I try to create it here just around where I live and other things. But so is there, are there big families in Mongolia? It sounds like you've got one child. Did you have any siblings there? Yeah, I have one brother in Mongolia, one of my sisters here. Now, like, women, families, and again, population is growing. The grown-up, 2.3 million people, the families, like, three and four kids, not... And, oh, there, one thing is, if women have delivered your fourth child, you get a very prestigious medal from the government being... Raising, like, what's the recognition? Like, it's, I think it's like a, being a, like, reward, like medal. It's very prestigious if you have a child. Your purple heart or something like you. Yeah, the similar. Honorable. Very honorable. And then when you go to the government building, they wear proper, really nice outfits. And then, you know, here is it, government really appreciate your, like, You know, it's a hard work. I appreciate your work. It's like fun. And then if you have seven child, a great mother, it's called a great mother middle one. And then you get more than seven children get the second one. Wow. Mothers are really well respected there. It's very interesting. Yeah. Do moms work as well? Oh, yeah, yeah. Grown up, all the mothers, there's no... Homestead mothers. Everyone works there. Because, you know, childcare is very secure. Your work employment is very sustainable. And then free education and free medical care. And you need to work. Everything is. So what kind of government is that that offers all that free? Is it socialist? Socialist, yeah. And then until 1991, one, during the Soviet Union collapsed, during the Karabachov, and then the entire country has changed because we have, like, even though we've been independent since 1921, we are kind of, like, sister country. Like, a lot of Soviets influence there. A lot of, we have, like, a lot of Russian influence there. And then, like, Russians, we, all of the products, everything, imports, everything from Russia, Soviet Union. And Soviet Union lived... We are on our own. So we start to face a lot of difficulties. Like your mom and dad left, you're on your own when you're a child. You have to learn how to survive the entire country. We had a very different, for five years during this transition period, I was pre-teen and we shortage of food, shortage of medical care. And we had like special, like small, like registering book from the government, distributing food based on the family, number of families, you know, that's like weekly, like essential groceries. And just quite tough time that time. So was that because you were more in the northern part of the country? Is the southern part that's closer to China, were they more China influenced or...? Is it the whole country is more Russia-influenced? More Russia-influenced. Interesting. Since 1921 till 1990, if you guys learn back to how Soviet Union class, all the former socialist communist country, Eastern European countries, how class it, that's Mongolian was Central Asian. Mongolia was one of these countries. That's why we had like a lot of difficulties to offer it. And then, you know, it's a lot. It's really hard working for years. Entire government changed. Even though we didn't have one single gunshot, the government changed dramatically. Even though dramatically, there's no conflicts. We didn't have like hunger strike, like any gunshots, any government from socialist to free market, democratic system, you know. And then we really, really smooth transition by then. So my childhood, I see the communist, socialist and transition and then a capitalist and free market. It's a different period happened back in Mongolia. Do you think they still have free healthcare? No, of course, you know, like there's nothing is free there. But still now, like I was talking to my mom like a week ago. When you get sick, you call to your hospital doctor and they will come to your house. Instead of you go to ER, the doctors will come to you to check your blood pressure and basic checkups. And then if you really need to go to hospital, you would go. Otherwise, they will prescribe certain things from the pharmacy. There's no, again, if you need better health. care, you will go to private hospitals, you know, but you have to pay. Now there's a lot of change happened when I was away, but growing up, you know, my healthcare was free, like Even the other place, even our apartment even belonged to this state. And then after transition, we had to own this place. My mom was like, no, this is not mine. This is the government. I don't need that. Like, yeah. So a lot of change happened by then. Yeah. Wow. Okay. And then the southern half of the country on a map, it's much like whiter. Is that where the mountains are? Yes. Mountains are in the northern side. In the southern side, it's a gobi. It's like a desert, like all the way, like, you know, camel and sand, like southern. It's like northern side, it's like Lake Tahoe, you know, like mountains, mountains. My family's from there. Every time we go to Mongolia, we go to southern side. It's like Lake Tahoe. The southern side is? No, on the southern side. The southern side is via people, but just desert. Okay, so not a lot of towns in that area? Yeah. There's a lot of towns, actually. I'm just looking at the map, and the very top of it looks green, and the rest looks brown, and then there looks like almost a whole bunch of white towards the bottom, which may be the desert. Yeah, yeah, deserts, yeah. And then, again, Avery, we used to have 18 provinces, like States kind of. And then now maybe it have changed government 18. And then again, some divided by then the biggest side, the smaller side, they all have the centers. That's how they're like all the hospitals and schools and then other like small families heard this around, you know. And then just south of Mongolia, it looks like actually in China, it says Inner Mongolia. I just saw that. Yeah, it's... I think Chinese, I think they got that part. The other people more proud to be Mongolians. They think they are Mongolians, but outer Mongolians, we think they are Chinese, even though they are the ones who keep the traditional scripts from China. Talk to bottom ones. We had the Russian influence. We have Cyrillic. We use the Cyrillics. Yeah. But they're speaking different dialect. And again, the Chinese, my mom said they used to have a lot of Mongolian culture there. But during the Chinese Revolution, they sent a lot of Chinese people the book, you know, like destroyed the temples, you know, like karaoke and like all of the supermarket, a lot of change there. Okay. It's almost like our New York or something. It's not really. I know I was going to ask you, do you, can you understand them when they talk? Is it just kind of a little different accent or? A different accent. Yeah. I can. Yeah. If I go to, you know, Mongolia, even the blue, blue capital, I don't know why they keep it still there, but still they have to cross the border, international border. And then I can understand them, but they have like a lot of Chinese influence there. Yeah. It's a Chinese, and it's a country. I don't know. Yeah, the people also, are you from outer Mongolia, inner Mongolia? I couldn't understand. There's only one Mongolia, you know. Maybe my proud ego maybe kicks in this, but there's inner Mongolia. So did you say blue capital? Yeah, that's the inner Mongolians, the capital called, not capital, the city called inner blue. Hukhut. Hukh means blue. Okay. Yeah.

UNKNOWN: 27:11

Oh.

SPEAKER_00: 27:12

I haven't seen. And then Ulaanbaatar, is that? That's where I'm from. Yeah, Ulaanbaatar, yeah. Yeah, got it. And then I was looking at Inner Mongolia. I don't see where it says that I'm totally butchered. Oh, yeah, Ulaanbaatar, yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay, Ulaanbaatar. Yeah, Ulaanbaatar, yeah.

UNKNOWN: 27:33

Okay.

SPEAKER_00: 27:33

Got it. It's like, I don't know if I'm saying it correctly, but the buildings, there's like regular buildings and then there's these beautiful old, you know, it looks, it's sorry to say if it's the palaces.

UNKNOWN: 27:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 27:51

Oh, the temples. Oh, the temples. Okay. Like this kind of building, like it's temple. We are Buddhist. The Mongolians are Buddhist. We were Buddhist until 1921, but during like socialist country, you're not supposed to have any religious, you know? Oh, really? Not supposed to have religion? No religious growing up. Like if you be not even allowed to, you know, again, Russians, Soviet Union did fantastic job 1921 you know mongolian we did like woman again educational literacy was 90 97 and the woman's right in education and the health care that's a fantastic job though we need any socialist communist country there's no religious it is that's why during that time a lot of temples are destroyed, unfortunately. And then growing up, you know, there's no God, there's no religious, but all the families may be very, modest way to celebrate Lunar New Year. You know, it's a religious, we have, you're supposed to celebrate only New Year, you know, not Lunar New Year. So they were one temple in the capital, but very, they were two big monks there, but very modest, you know. If you see, if I see North Korean, It's very similar growing up, but they're awful, you know, they cannot, but like the structure, yeah, the structure is very similar. You know, we're not allowed to leave any other countries except communist countries. Romania, Czechoslovakia, you know, like Soviet Union, you know, they're okay, but we're not allowed to even go to visit any, not the, East Germany, I think, okay, a lot of people get integrated in Cuba, in, former Soviet country, Soviet Union, and then Eastern European countries. But not for, you know, not for, America not even think about that, that America is gun money, the real, like, all this, like, propaganda, you know, like Americans, which still true, they're gun and money, but, you know. Okay. So was it hard for you to come to America then? No, by then it's changed a lot. I had traveled a lot internationally for my work, but still getting behind, we need to get a visa. So under my passport, I had a lot of countries visa, but still it's safe a woman invite me. So my American friend, she invited me. That's easier than... men invite me, you know. Oh, okay. Still, it's very difficult to get a visa, American visa. A tourist visa is still very strict in other countries, yeah. Oh, okay. Oh, my goodness. I thought before Americans going to Mongolia, is that pretty open? No, very open, yeah. And I think, I don't think you need a visa on like 30 days. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. But if you live there longer, you need to like certain other documents. We had someone on the podcast that is from here, loves Mongolia, goes in kind of the, you know, outdoors area. areas and loves it. Last time when I was in Mongolia, I took two sets of family, 10 of us went, my son's friend's family, 10 of us went from San Francisco to Shanghai, Shanghai to Beijing. And then we took a trans-Siberian train from Beijing to Ulaanbaatar. And then we traveled to North and South. And then I was really proud of like, my country, you know, like when you stop by in a countryside, the yurt, like nothing is a couple of yurt. When I go there, there's no even lock. You can come in and then family or have tea and sit and talk. It's really nice. I really wanted to show them real, you know, how what the countryside is. So they were like, big gathering is happening. I was like, what is it? Let's go there. And then we went there like family reunion. And then when joined it, they ask her to come sit and then play and then very curious about foreigners. It's nice, you know, we cannot, in Texas, if I go there, I cannot crash the family reunion, you know. Going back there, they're very, you know, like family open. Oh, I went to America years ago, this, this, and then city and then play it like, I was like, oh, this is my people. Everyone is welcoming. Yeah. That's so wonderful. What kind of tea do you typically have there? We call it green tea, but it's not the green tea we drink here. I think it's a black tea with a tiny bit of salt, a bit of cream. With salt? Salt and cream, yeah. Wow, it's so funny because usually here it's sugar and cream. Sugar and cream, yeah. And they're like salt and cream. Yeah, I think it's a black tea. But because of color, we always say, oh, we drink green tea. It's a green tea. But now when I think of it, it's not a green tea. I think we get it a lot from Uzbekistan or Tajikistan. They have a very big tea. I think it's more from there, yeah. Oh, my goodness. Wow. And then what about jobs? I'm just curious. I find people jobs. So I was curious, is it all... Because it looks like Ulaanbaatar is a city. So people, I'm sure there's banks and... Oh, yeah, yeah. It's like any other big cities. Again, a lot of young generation struggles finding a job. You don't see any homeless people in the city. But still, like any other countries, we are having a lot of employment issues there.

UNKNOWN: 34:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 34:02

Yeah, it's very difficult when I go back home, how people are living, because people's appearance is really, well, good there. But actually, what, you know, what's the behind that, what they struggle with, you know, unless your family relatives are, you know, really struggles, we would know. But for the appearance, you can't really, it's hard to know them. If someone are not doing well financially or like, you know, it's hard because the people, look good there yeah great yeah yeah it's like uh people really put together families young people like like dress well and looking happy but even though they still struggle behind that like financial and employment and everything it's yeah it's like i have i like to when i go back i like to observe the people you know it's yeah that's so interesting with like You know, because you said, Vern, like, you know, your appearance is really important. You look good, but you also don't buy a lot of things, do you? So do people, like, have a pretty small wardrobe? And they just, it's clean and pressed, but it might not be for you. We iron things all the time. Iron bed sheets, iron shirt, you know? You're having bed sheets, huh? Oh, yeah, bed sheets. Growing up, all those air, and we're like, yeah, like, we don't have, like, big wardrobe, you know, like, every, still now, like, three, four bedrooms, and then maybe five family, five, six families, but, you know, we have to share everything, you know, share the space, share the wardrobe. Still, you would know, you would know, because we don't buy things that a lot. That's also really, still, I have some difficulties to adjust here. Oh, yeah. I have difficulties with it. Especially Christmas time, you know, like, how many presents one person can open? Like, I always have this, like... difference with my husband. I had to face it. You know, we have one child and then, okay, this is enough. Now, I think it's just a few. Maybe we need, no. Yeah, you can watch the, there's a documentary called Buy Now that'll stop you from shopping ever again. Oh, really? Buy? Buy Now. I don't know if it's on Netflix or Apple or, but yeah, Buy Now. Now. Yeah. I'm going to watch it because I feel this is a big thing for me too. And I, especially when the kids are little, They just, I want that. I want that. Please buy. You know, you get a lot of that. And you're like, yeah. Yeah. Well, yeah, that's how you grab it. We didn't know. Yeah. I'm very careful about quality and quantity. And even though I can buy everything for myself, but my husband thinks, oh, you don't. Yeah. Less is more. I actually remember talking to someone in Europe. I can't remember. And they said, when people go, like, was the men go to work, they wear the same outfit all week. It's almost like a uniform. And I was just thinking about that the other day. I'm like, men's suits probably were really, uniform men would probably have like two suits, a clean one and a dirty one, you know? But now men have like, you know, people that wear suits every day probably have like 15, 20 suits and then different ties. You know, probably the tie was like originally the only difference. Like you'd wear the exact same suit every day and just change your tie to mix it up. Yeah. Yeah. Interesting. So just curious, I know we're coming up on Christmas. So what does Christmas look like in Mongolia? Oh, we don't celebrate Christmas. Okay. But we celebrate New Year. Oh, okay. Again, I don't think Russians celebrate Christmas. Again, we didn't have any religious. There's no religious. We can celebrate New Year. Oh, New Year. I miss New Year. Every... Companies have paid big, big parties. People warm and dress nice. And like everything is like, I really miss that. It's like all parties are real parties are there, you know, like. Nice. Yeah. So that's a new year like our calendar New Year's, not like the Chinese New Year. Yeah. 31st, December 30th, even though it's a family holiday. Like every family has a Christmas tree and then cake and flowers and champagne. I don't know why cake, but like we, my parents not let us to sleep until midnight because we celebrated like happy New Year, you know, like, you know, like it's very family oriented holiday New Year. It's like we have to, like, it's like, it's like Thanksgiving, you know, like we have to sit, eat together kind of things. Oh my gosh. So they, you do get to stay up till midnight or you don't get to stay up till midnight? Oh, it's like, I have to, have to, have to stand up. We have to receive the New Year like that. I don't know why even for small kids can't go to bed. Totally. I remember going to Midnight Mass and I was like, oh, this is so hard with them. Is Midnight Mass have to be in midnight too? Well, I guess. I felt like it was 11 o'clock or something, 10, 11. Yeah, I think that was typical on Christmas. So they'd always have like a midnight mass. So then like not for New Year's, but on Christmas Day. But then a lot of people, the kids couldn't stay up. So then the churches started having 11 o'clock and a 10 o'clock and an 8 o'clock. Now I think it's like 5 o'clock. Yeah, exactly. So did you say they have a Christmas tree at New Year's? Yeah, we call it New Year's tea. We didn't call it Christmas tree. People start to put it near Christmas tree around 26th, 27th. Way after Christmas. Oh my God. And so, and is it a, is it a pine tree? Is it the same? Oh, it's a plastic, plastic one. Yeah. It's freaking cold out there. There's no, yeah. Yeah. And we even have a Santa, but Santa, we don't call it Santa, winter camper. And we have like, I think it's all, if you see the, We have a traditional outfit at Santa, but we big cave and big white beard and then certain gloves. And then Santa come visit families, give the presents to small kids. Uh-huh. And it looks like Mongolia Santa looks like he belongs in the North Pole with a very fluffy big hat. Yes. A beard and a big coat. He looks very... He looks, it's interesting, the look, you know, he looks like, you said Native American, but Mongolian, right? Oh, yeah. Like, yeah. And he's got, it looks like he's, well, the picture I'm seeing, he looks like he's riding a horse, but it has antlers. And then he has a big, backpack sack. It almost looks like one of those fabric things that you wear babies with, but a huge bigger one that's honestly filled with things. It looks like a wizard. It's very mixed with Santa's traditional old man. That's so funny. So interesting. During Komi's time, I think we created it, yeah. Wow. Oh my gosh. So would you get presents for the New Year's? Yeah, New Year's, the presents are all like mandarin, tangerine, and candies. We didn't get any actual presents by then. It's just the candies and tangerines and fruit in winter, like growing up. Yeah, we didn't. But in the Lunar New Year, We have a calendar, same as Tibetans, different than Chinese for some reason, always similar, like two or three days either behind or then front. It's like it's never been lined in the same day. It's always different day, the Chinese Lunar New Year. That one is a big celebration. We have to have constant visitors, relatives visit you regularly. If you have elders in your family, the relatives visit you, and then we eat dumplings and sit, talk. And then the family, the elders will give a present. It's like a week-long holiday. And it's nice. Once in a year, you will see all of the relatives, two become three, three become four, all of them bringing kids, and then sit and talk and eat dumplings. Oh, nice.

UNKNOWN: 42:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 42:52

So I definitely have some of our rapid fire questions. I sent that to you so long ago. I don't know if you remember, but they're pretty easy. Yeah, pretty easy. Okay. So other than Christmas or New Year's, is there another popular holiday tradition? Oh, yeah. In July 11th, it's Independence Day. I think it's a day we kick the Chinese out. I think it's like, that's a really big holiday. We call it free men's, we call it nadam. It's like free, it's a horse racing and wrestling and then archery.

SPEAKER_01: 43:30

That's

SPEAKER_00: 43:31

a big celebration. That's the most popular tourist season by that. And every other place is celebrating a week-long celebration, horse racing and wrestling and then archery. It's summertime and people relax, watch the horse racing and wrestling is a big sport and then archery too. And it's actually, it looks like it goes for four days? Yeah, maybe less. like officially four days, but like you're not going to do any business that week, whole entire, even for a month. Yeah. It's like everyone is like, everything is like tomorrow, tomorrow, tomorrow, like no business. Gotta enjoy summer, right? Yeah. Because our summer is very short. We have to celebrate at least one week. Yeah, exactly. It looks like, does the date change? Or you said July 11th. Yeah, it's almost July 11th, yeah. It says, N-A-A-D-A-M from Friday, July 11th to Tuesday, July 15th. Yeah. Oh, and it says Mongolia, Inner Mongolia and Tuva is where it is. Oh, this is Tuva. Yeah. I think, I don't know. Yeah. Is that another country? Yeah. I think Tuva is, I think that was a part of the Soviet Union. And I think maybe it's a country now, like with the center, like central, I think it's a central Asia. Yeah. Oh, wow. It looks, this is really interesting. And I see, what is this? It looks like girls with a whole bunch of, like a sash with a whole bunch of patches all the way down. Oh, like horse riders? Well, I actually clicked on it. Oh, wow. They have a, yes. There's a whole bunch of horses and they're just running across a field. Yeah. Is that, and everyone's got helmets and A name, or is it a horse race? Oh, horse race, yeah. Yeah, I think nowadays wearing helmets, but, you know, growing up, no one is wearing helmets. And, you know, like horse riding is like, you can learn, you know, when you're free, you know, three years old, you will see three or four years old, you're riding horse and cattle, like it's a very normal holiday, yeah. Yeah, I see horses. You said archery, which I see as well. I see traditional outfits, beautiful outfits with a very long. Yeah, that's for men. Yeah, it's very colorful. And I thought I heard you say wrestling, and I actually see some men wrestling. Yeah, only men wrestle, not women doing that. Yeah. Very interesting outfit, by the way. Yeah. Bikini. You see that? Bikini bottoms with very, very, very big, like, I'll call them cowboy boots, but very big boots, like boots. Yeah. And then a very small halter top that looks like it's tied on the sides here. Yeah. Very different. Very different. Yeah. Like, wow. So, yeah. Horse race, wrestling, archery, knuckle bone shooting. Oh, yeah. Knucklebone shooting. I think that's not the official, like, free games, but that's the, like, you can be a part of. I think it's, I don't really have family with it. I think they're, like, how far you can, what do you call this one? Like, how far the knuckleball players go. It's wherever it gets the farther away. I think, yeah. Yeah, it says anklebone and shooting and must be knucklebone, something like that. That's, yeah. definitely different. Yeah, a lot of foreigners go to that nadam during tourist season, yeah. Yeah, so they go in July to check out. July, yeah, it's very crowded. Everything is really busy at that time, like busy, like holiday busy, yeah. Is that, are there other holidays that someone, or if you're wanting to travel to Mongolia and check it out, that would be An event too. Yeah, event. Yeah. But again, that will be like business time. But even after NADM, maybe some of the countryside, some of them, they have like mini NADM, you know, to attract the tourists. Otherwise, that's like a main. We don't have many like celebration holidays. Only Lunar New Year and then NADM. Like only two, yeah. Yeah. That's interesting. I love it. Yeah. And so what is your favorite meal when you go back? My favorite, oh, it's like, kind of like perushki, but it's like, I think we get it from Russia. Like, it's like a fried, it's called khoshur. It's like a dumpling, but flat. It's a fried, fried dumpling. What's inside? Just, you know. Food, we have like most boring food in the world. We have, because it's hard to grow vegetables there because of season, you know. Right, I remember it's like a lot of beets, right? Yeah, it's like beef in salt, herbs, and then flour, you know. Oh, okay. That sounds really good. And what's a typical breakfast? When I breakfast, we eat a lot of like eggs and toast. Oh, okay. Yeah. Pretty similar. Yeah.

UNKNOWN: 48:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 48:58

And what is the money call and how do you, like, how would a tourist handle the money there when they go? I think Tukruk. Okay. Yeah. And I think they bring the cash. Okay. Again, I wouldn't be surprised if when someone is there, oh, you can pay through Apple, you know, like there's certain things the way I had my phone when I was two years old. In 2000, I had my cell phone. My even husband was like, oh my God, you have cell phone. Like, yeah, everyone has a cell phone. But here, the cell phone came way later. Like, yeah, it's like some certain things we have very, like we get it way before America, like technology, but a lot of things like way after, yeah. We had like, I wouldn't be surprised all the money transactions goes through the phone, you know, some certain apps. Yeah. All righty. And then one question we ask is, we just ask every time, the closest place to surf, I would say probably in the lake. Is there like anything such as like wake surfing or wake boarding out there or water skiing? No. We're afraid of water. And we're not even growing up, water is very precious thing. If you go see any lake in spring, it's We just, we cannot even put our feet on there because it's very spirit things. We only, we can't even go, can't even think about peeing there. It's very sacred things. We should just go like tap the water, put in the head first, you know, it's like, we can't even think. I don't know nowadays, but like growing up, we can't even put your things, anything, even your feet, because it's nature of sacred things. Oh, that's so interesting. Yeah. And it's probably so cold too, right? Yeah. Yeah. It's cold. Yeah. Are you, well, you said you drink cheese. Most people drink coffee or tea or both? Tea. Nowadays, maybe in the capital, but we don't have Starbucks, but there's a lot of coffee shops. People drink coffee. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Well, that's it for my rapid fire questions. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you so much. Of course. Thank you for having me. Yeah. Yeah. We loved it. It gave me such a different visual and feeling about Mongolia. And honestly, I do remember... the first person, it was very interesting. And I thought, okay, well, you know, I don't know if that would be for me. But after talking with you, I'm like, oh my goodness, this sounds really a treat to go. I would love to go. Oh, yeah. Oh my God. If you go, let me know. But it's very interesting. You'll see how people lived 300 years ago. It's still the same.

SPEAKER_01: 51:47

Nothing

SPEAKER_00: 51:48

has changed. But it's in a good way how everything changed. you you cannot waste but still people are going this way you know like and then again in the capital you will see people you know like any other big cities women will look at time bank you know the things that some some of them is too materialistic for me but it's it's very it's one way you can see two buff sides in one place yeah it almost seems like everyone needs to go there because Or watch the Buy Now video. Oh, yeah. I would love that. Yeah. Especially before Christmas. Yes. Yeah. Absolutely. Yeah. Wonderful. Well, thank you so much. Of course. Thank you. Absolutely. Thank you, Grace. Nice to meet you. Bye-bye. Have a good weekend. Bye. Happy holidays. Happy holidays. Bye. Thanks for listening. If you enjoyed the podcast, can you please take a second and do a quick follow of the show and rate us in your podcast app? And if you have a minute, we would really appreciate a review. Following and rating is the best way to support us. If you're on Instagram, let's connect. We're at where next podcast. Thanks again.

UNKNOWN: 53:17

Thank you.